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drew734

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Reply with quote  #1 
As per rule 1 in the club rules only oars and fins may be used to move your floatube, kickboat or Kayak. No propulsion devise of any kind is allowed. If you have any questions please contact the tournament director. Andy Mercado
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Ring_King

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Reply with quote  #2 
Does my kayak pass for this?  Mine uses fins that are driven by my pedals.  Its a Hobie Mirage Drive.  Still human powered with no electronic, gas, or gear reduction to assist.  100% human power
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Ring_King

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Reply with quote  #3 
Just went back and re-read the rules.  The rule states that "Only fins and oars may power float tubes, kickboats and kayaks. The use of motors and sails is prohibited."  This kinda leave me in a gray area I think.  I don't use a motor or sails, and technically my kayak uses fins in the form of the Hobie Mirage Drive which is a 1:1 gear ratio.  So it is without a doubt man powered.  I guess I'll wait to hear the verdict on this one.  Sure would like to fish with you guys but obviously not going to be able to if my rig is disqualified.
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ILOVEFATGIRLS

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Reply with quote  #4 
Yeah it's not Clarified to the exact little detail, but This is only my first year so don't quote me but I think this rule was made before the Hobie Mirage drive was around?? Maybe club vote ? Let the officers decide?? The fastest I can row with slack wind would be about 2.8-3.5 mph . I can maintain this with no breaks for 1 hour straight- example - from yorty launch I can row all the way to the very back of cherry, past the camp spots to where the water gets very skinny. I haven't tried a hobie mirage drive, but I know those things JAM!! That hobie Definitely has an advantage over the kick boats, But then again the kick boats have an advantage over the belly boats. (Faster) The gear ratio is 1-1 but what about thrust? The mirage drive Definitely has a huge advantage ! For my kick boat to keep up with your hobie I would probably have to put at least a 45 thrust electric trolling motor. Don't quote me on this but I think every 25 pounds of electric thrust is approximately equivalent to 1 horse ? I heard that somewhere- I will tell you what- I could definitely use a hobie for the Berryessa tournament!!! just my 2 cent$ see you Saturday
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Ring_King

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Reply with quote  #5 
I'm waiting on an email response from Andy Mercado. Guess we'll see what they say. When I'm loaded for a tournament and really cranking on the pedals I get around 5mph. Of course I can't maintain that for any length of time. I can maintain 3.5mph for quite a ways though. Is it an advantage? Sure, but I have no reverse in my Hobie. If I was in a Wilderness Systems Tarpon 160 I would get a top speed of almost 7mph with a traditional kayak paddle. Maintaining that speed would be fairly easy
as well due to the hull shape and length. That would also be an advantage over a kick boat but would still be allowed per the rules. I was told at the Lake Sonoma event that my Hobie was very nice, but that kick boats were more versatile. Does that mean that I'm the one actually at a disadvantage?

Ill see y'all this weekend if I'm allowed to fish. If not I'm headed back to Clear Lake!
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ILOVEFATGIRLS

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Reply with quote  #6 
Yeah my top end is 3.5 mph & that is only rowing backwards on the thrust of the oar not the glide after the thrust, it is a constant change & never a Consistent speed. If there is wind- sometimes you cant even gain any ground at all or very little(under 1 mph).There is pros and cons to all boats . You smoked all of us at Lake Sonoma, But would I want to fish out of your boat if I was staying in the keys and flipping all day? He'll no!! But If I wanna hit some big main lake points at berry during a short 6 hour Tournament then I would definitely want The hobie!! There's pros and cons to everything . if you can't fish then get a bucks bag I think we still get a 50% discount or close to it? Anyways hope 2 c u out there man
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Ring_King

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Reply with quote  #7 
Well it's official. I'm out of the tournament. I would be allowed to fish but only if I used a paddle instead of the Mirage Drive. The problem is that under paddle power I'd be lucky to hit 1.5mph. The hull is too wide and just not designed to be paddled. It would be impractical and unsafe to try and traverse any water under power paddle.

It's a shame, but y'all have fun out there. If you see me on the water feel free to stop and say hello.

Matthew
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basserdave

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Reply with quote  #8 
Jason,  If you can go 3.5 miles in one hour non stop in a kick boat then YOU ARE THE MAN.  I know what a GPS will say if you really get on it but you cant do it for 3.5 miles.  If you can I stand corrected.
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2 8.5 lbs The Pond Zoom Trick Worm
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Ring_King

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Reply with quote  #9 
I think my problem with this ruling is that I supposedly have a speed/distance advantage over a kick boat. Doesn't a kick boat have a speed/distance advantage over a belly boat? Doesn't someone with a depth sounder have an advantage over those members that don't? As I mentioned earlier a Tarpon 160 kayak can blow my doors off and maintain 6-7mph for long distances. Does that mean that they would have an advantage over a kick boat? Would they then be disallowed as well? It sounds as though the rules need to be changed to exclude kayaks altogether. Sorry if I sound a little bitter but I'm pulling two 12 hour shifts this week so that someone would cover for me Friday and Saturday so that I could fish the tourney. If someone had an issue with my craft then maybe they should have spoken up a little sooner than the week of the event! It kinda pisses me off a bit which I'm sure you all can understand. Funny thing about this is there were several guys that fished farther from the launch than I did on Lake Sonoma!Sonoma and nobody seemed to mind those guys "advantage"!

In the explanation of my being uneligible to fish it was mentioned that kayaks have fished with the club in the past. Was there no issue with those guys? Any kayaker in any decent craft is easily able to surpass 3.5mph with very little effort. So why was my craft singled out as being too much of an advantage? Had Byrd and I not won the Lake Sonoma event would this have even been brought up?

I'm really feeling discriminated against here.
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ILOVEFATGIRLS

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Reply with quote  #10 
Dave - Like I said very top speed is 3.5 on very very powerful full oar, full body rowing!! Cru style!! Yes I can row 3 miles straight without stopping, I've rowed from library park past rocky point at Clearlake as well as going to the campgrounds at cherry. This is only on a backwards row. I have buddies with scaddens & bucks bags and they think it's the way the rockers are Designed on my fish cat- It is quite yare! (Quick) hence the name .... IR - improved rocker, I guess? It does cut through the water nicely !! I know some cheaper & shorter boats can be TURTLES!!! Brannon- that sucks dude!! Oh well now it looks like I place automatically one spot higher if you're not there- lol ! You should get a paddle or a kick boat & come catch some fish with us!! Especially for the two-day event at Clearlake- The CLASSIC!! you can't miss that one man! I haven't done that one yet, but I did the 2 day event back in April at Clearlake and it was the most fun I ever had!!!! Maybe i will see you at clear after berryessa, I plan on going quite a bit up there after this weekend. Lets go "WAKE" em up .
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ILOVEFATGIRLS

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Reply with quote  #11 
It's Not the point that anything is an advantage or disadvantage of course everything has pros and cons. They are not trying to single you out but when the rules were made - of course they were talking about fins you wear on your feet! No one cares if you have a paddle. There is definitely no advantage on how far you go or how close you stay to the ramp- For example the Lake Mendocino tournament was won right at the ramp the only limit and a big one at that ! 10 feet away from where we launched. Just get a paddle and nobody can say anything and then come take some more money. Sure yeah I can go down and get an 18 foot ocean expedition kayak and probably go 12 mph does that mean I'm gonna win any money ? Maybe the rules do need revision? Anyways You've already shown us you're a good stick, so grab a paddle and come have some fun-
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vermonster

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Reply with quote  #12 
just wanted to add my 2 on the matter and it's just my opinion.  
    I think the only problem stems from the fact that you have a mechanical drive system that allows a 14 ft craft to be pushed at 5 mph even with your hands free.  The club has never had one of these drive systems compete to my knowledge so its the first time the officers have had to react to it.  i wouldn't take it personal though.....the club would be deciding to go in a totally different direction if the drive systems are allowed. You are obviously a skilled angler and we would love for you to compete!!
again, just my thoughts and hope to see ya out there....
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Ring_King

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Reply with quote  #13 
It's just not safe or worth it to try and paddle a Pro Angler. The hull wasn't made for it and I wouldn't be able to get out of my own way under paddle power. I've tried it before just to see how it would work in the case of a Mirage Drive failure, and anything more than a half mile would damn near kill you! I could literally get out and swim faster than I could paddle. Kayak companies don't even make a paddle that's suitably long enough to use with the Pro Angler due to the width of the hull and the seating height.

I guess I'm just out of luck on this one!

If you ever want to go sling some swim baits give me a shout! Clear Lake might just be my new weekend past time since there are no bass tournaments that will allow to fish out of my Hobie. I've got over $4000 invested in my rig and trailer. It's too late for me to switch to a kickboat. Not to mention the Coast Guard only has me here for 4 years and then the kickboat would be useless to me as they aren't used anywhere on the East or Gulf coasts. It's all kayaks over there!

Matthew
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ILOVEFATGIRLS

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Reply with quote  #14 
Will pm you after berry & then go hit up clear ! I'm anxious to get fishin alot more now the little one is back in school 2 maro and work will slow down as it gets cooler
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bagdadfisher

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Reply with quote  #15 
And this debate is EXACTLY why the club has voted in the past NOT to allow kayaks ... oh well ... maybe next year we will vote them out again... 
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